Kamala's genuine smile and Walz's empathetic version of manhood is coming through loud and clear—and may explain the joy that is coursing through the Democratic Party. Meanwhile, Vance remains a popularity sinkhole. Plus, the prospects for Texas ever turning blue, Cancun Cruz, Latino voters, getting the young to the polls, and staying in to fight the good fight. Beto O'Rourke joins Tim Miller.
show notes
Beto's Texas voter registration group, "Powered by People"
Beto wrote about visiting Ulysses, Kansas in 2018
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I got to say I couldn’t disagree more with Beto with respect to immigration. No president will expend the type of political capital that is necessary to advance immigration reform. For one, like 5 presidents have and absolutely nothing got done. Why try to do something that you know will have absolutely zero chance of happening? This would be like asking a president to tackle gun control. Yes it’s the right thing to do but you have to win reelection and when you blow all your political capital on something that (1) won’t happen and (2) even if it did it would take YEARS to see the fruit of the legislation, thus killing g your reelection chances.
The only way this gets done is if a republican president does it and even then it still won’t get done (see Trump, bush 2 and bush 1). DOA
I have to correct a major non-political error Tim Miller made here. Zack Bryan is indie. He's not pop or punk but then he's not country really either. He's more in line with alternative folk with a Springsteen on the prarie style. But there is a major country adjacent indie movement that's he's rode to superstar status. This movement and his style in particular is like punk in that they are pushing back on overproduced assembly line art in the same manner that the DIY punks in the 70's and 80's pushed back on bloated arena rock.
A call for action in the Public school superintendent of all North Carolina public schools, please
Tim Please talk about the woman In North Carolina named Michele Morrow, that is running for superintendent of all public schools in North Carolina
She is a nurse and a mother of five who homeschool
She is called for the execution of Barack Obama and Joe Biden before a firing squad
Here is one of her quotes:
“ I prefer a pay-per-view of him ( Obama ) in front of a firing squad. I do not want to waste another dime on supporting his life
We could make some money back from televising his death death “
She calls for violence against all Democrats
Please bring attention to this so focus could be on this race and election in North Carolina
Would you or anyone on the Bulwark want their children around this woman?
Holy shit
With this extreme narcissistic maga
Mocking ridiculing, Christian nationalism and White nationalism is emotional abuse to the citizens of this country, and those that have joined the cult
The important thing is about the families
It is child abuse to the children, and these families
The men, especially how they talk is how they talk to their children
They don’t teach decency on her character, integrity, and respect
They emotionally violate their own children
Especially the women being mothers talking like that around their children
The trauma, the emotional trauma from a malignant narcissistic environment is a real thing
They are walking wounded in this country, full of trauma from malignant, narcissistic horrible talk
Good parents do not talk like
The children associated with them and attached to them are getting emotionally, abused and not taking care of emotionally by good parents
Shame on the women abandon themselves as women, emotionally to mirror and copy These vicious, violent men
It is domestic terrorism to this country
And it is domestic violence in those families
Beto rocks! He came sooooo close in Texas. Great to hear from him!
Tim, I just joined the Bulwark (finally!) so i could comment on how much i am loving your podcast. Also, I have listened to "Love is All Around" by Husker Du about 100 times since I heard it last night...the music at the end of each episode is fire. Came here by way of PSA, glad to be part of this community. You rock.
Welcome and thanks!
Here’s a playlist of the end of pod songs. https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0dApY6YT48kTh6j9xFDQch?si=_mnMuHWESMWUaYrdYCUMPA&pi=u-__w9R6XvRImq
There is something about this discussion that bothered me, as a female. Really, I didn't know boys were suffering now because they are no longer the alpha dudes they were in the past? I mean, how awful for them that women are demanding an equal place in our country. It must be so hard for these disaffected young men, even with all that "affirmative action" of being male. (I don't know how Tim Walz could fix them.)
Also, and this odd comment was from Tim - that it takes a really strong man to be the wingman for his female boss. Really? Sounds really sexist, but that could just be me.
This is exactly why the problem is so difficult to solve (btw this is true for people of color and affirmative action). Any steps up the ladder that women or minorities take, white males feel aggrieved. It’s fucked up
It’s like they have a bit of that Trump entitlement gene and the whine gene in them no matter what their politics are.
Imo it’s time for women to run things in this world so I have less than zero sympathy for the sad young men who no longer get the automatic power because of their gender.
Oh I don’t disagree but unfortunately their are a lot of them and they tend to be angry,
Dumb and violent
Beto is genuine, plain and simple.
Tim, Here’s my favorite Bob Mould tune:
https://open.spotify.com/track/5CJ6YOanLUEhhiz2n3DdD4?si=1Ih980uCRQCNJT4FtIQIeQ
beto, just impressive and a good spokesman for these issues.
Jesus! Listened to first five minutes and it’s the drab-Republican Tim back in full no fun mode. Bruh, one second you are coconut pilled and excited about the vibes next second Tim shits on the DNC. We know you dislike Biden but if you wanna make friends with our side you gotta accept the full meal deal.
The first night was awesome and should be celebrated but glad you could find the disgruntled Dem who wasn’t invited to speak so he could shit on it with you.
So true man, I watched the whole DNC, 2 nights so far, and I'm just loving it. It's normal people having a normal political party, not all that backstabbing and lying the Republicans do . . . now their convention was one awful party. Imagine how hard it was for the Republicans to even have fun at their party with all this American carnage and the invasion and the illegals killing everyone and people getting shot just for buying bread. What a dismal affair that was.
I don’t have to accept the full meal deal actually! Accepting the full meal
Deal was the folly that was gonna lead us to Trump 2.0. This is not going to be a podcast where I pretend to think bad or ineffective things are good. I thought Beto was thoughtful and interesting and candid and frankly too progressive for my taste in some answers. If people don’t like hearing that all good lots of podcasts in the sea. But on this one I will be expressing my honest views 🍻
Agree with you Tim! I listen to your pods for the variety of viewpoints and insights that you deliver every day. I don't always agree with you or your guests, but I always learn something or have the opportunity to look at issues from different perspectives. We don't need to be gaslit like the maga crowd who freak out over the tiniest of critiques of their orange leader. We're stronger and smarter than that. Keep bringing it Tim!!
I first discovered Beto when he did the road trip with the Republican rep. He is a different kind of politician and I wish he was still an office holder. We need more like Beto.
Does O'Rourke throw F bombs around at home as often as his podcast appearances?
F’n right he does!😉
I miss Charlie
Tim!!!!! What a jaded point of view. Watching the first night of the convention was a wonderful treat for this 72 year old recovering Republican. Rev Warnock preached it, AOC rocked, Hillary gave the best speech of her life. The young women’s abortion stories were potent.There was a spirit of joy and fun. I love the Bulwark and your somewhat cynical comments are great….but not on this convention mealy mouthing. We Democrats needed to celebrate our tribe-we needed the energy, we needed to see our deep bench of stars. We needed to laugh at the goofiness. We are primed- come on-get with it. You don’t need to find an excuse to criticize. Just let it roll.
It was a huge treat for me too! All these people who think like me in one place talking about it! It was fun and interesting. I also felt everyone was being authentic. I don't care that people read their speeches. So what?
Tim is still a Republican, that's why he didn't like it. But why didn't Beto like it? I detected a little leftover bitterness from him at all those lost elections? Now he's relegated to signing people up to vote. (I wonder if he's still making his wife do all the child care and housecleaning, like when he took off to write his On the Road thoughts.) Sorry these super-masculine "guy's guys" didn't like people having hope and fun for a change.
Yes! My thoughts exactly. Some of those speeches made me what to stand up and cheer and others had me crying
Omg. Yes. Exactly this. EXACTLY THIS. thank you.
Tim, I thought the unity message was important. Inviting everyone into this tent. I dont know what else you would have had the Dems do. Harris and Walz are at a Milwaukee rally tonight which is amazing and I thought Senator Warnok’s speech was inspiring. If Dems get into a policy wonky convention, they’ll be criticized for that. Conventions are what they are and I look forward to tonight’s inspiring, joyful speeches after the RNC’s doom and gloom.
Beto is sure enthusiastic, optimistic and off the cuff honest. But given the fact that Texas keeps reelecting Cruz, Abbott, Paxton and Republican legislators by a healthy margin, I wonder if he feels like taking a pillow and screaming into it. Texas is getting less red but as Sarah once mentioned in the 2020 (Democrats putting money there) "don't mess with Texas"
It’s really funny how even democrats view politics so asymmetrical. Beto talks about how dems have been taking advantage of Latinos and thus why they are losing but then describes how republicans do nothing for their voters and just keep getting reelected.
I think Beto should move to another state like Georgia where he'd have a good chance at winning a race for something, anything. He can't do much in Texas.
Tim is such a whiner. He doesn’t like Walz and if he were running the convention it would be excellent. What has he ever won? Jeb! Both he and Sarah joined a party that hates them but we should just listen to them.
Get on board or just shut up. Thank you.
I think it's true that Tim (and a few others) was a Shapiro True Believer (yes almost to cult-like status, and seemingly based on very little) and I'm also getting tired of hearing all the Walz whining and pondering and worrying. My god, Walz is perfect. I can't believe the hosts of this network can't see that. Get on board!
Why are you even listening to this podcast? And how can Tim shut up on his own podcast? It seem if you don't like hearing a variety of viewpoints, some which may be different than you're own, you are on the wrong website.
People are paying to be here, so probably not on the wrong website.
Strong Blue Maga Pyonyang energy here.
Holy shit, I thought we were in a rational place here. The commenter was right. The Bulwark people have been criticizing the idea of Walz and whining about Walz waaaaaaay too much. And when Tim hates on the DNC, he brings down the hope and the positive vibe for Harris and the Democrats. I have the same criticism for Beto. I can't figure out what the hell is wrong with him. He sounded like a Debbie Downer right when everything is going GREAT for Democrats.
Sorry you lost your party to Maga so criticize us if you must. Not helpful tho
Registered Democrat and donor since 1989.
Good grief. Reread your post - you sound like a MAGA cult type. This is a free speech zone, bro.
And Steven is allowed to express his opinion so suck it bruh. Free speech zone, browski.
Steven's "opinion" is that Tim should "shut up" if he won't "get on board." I never asked Steven to shut up, just suggested that he reread his post and rethink how closely he wants to resemble all those expansive souls in MAGA world. Hope that helps you puzzle all this through.
"Suck it bruh?" Are you in high school? If you all don't like Tim Miller, or a variety of viewpoints, then don't listen.
I liked that you agreed with Beto about vouchers, Tim. Bulwarkers always seem to support “school choice”, but everything I’ve ever seen shows that to be a code for dismantling the local public schools. I’ve been hoping you would be open to reconsidering that support, thanks!
It’s crazy how stupid school vouchers are when you spend 30 seconds thinking about it. It’s a non starter in most cities (lack of cars for the poor and the distance between schools) and rural areas (zero private schools). It literally only works for the middle class in the suburbs.
Best way to keep your rural voters poorly educated is to gut what little money red states invest in rural schools.
There wasn’t an end song…🙄
George Washington is the only other president I can think of who willingly stepped down from power.
LBJ did not run for a second term.
Thanks.That makes three!
Man, Beto is the best. Someday Texas will turn blue and we will all need to thank him. For me, he’s one of the best Democratic voices out there.
Ditto for Abrams ans the glimpses we’ve had at this in GA.
A lot of these “red states” are a couple points of turnout away from being purple or blue. It ain’t that crazy.
Here’s what I didn’t hear last night that I wanted.
This guy thinks he’s the answer to our questions?
Give me a break, that’s a bunch of malarkey.
My 24 year old son who played some high level basketball had the Kerr speech hit his feeds today, had him jazzed. His girlfriend’s feed had the testimonials. I was really impressed with last night. It’s the first convention I’ve watched in awhile that didn’t feel like an infomercial. Some powerful speakers speaking from their heart and their own journeys. A+
This is how old I am--I HAVE THIS SINGLE! (Husker Du's version of the Mary Tyler Moore show theme song). They aren't my favorite Minnesota band--I loved the Replacements and saw them 7 or 8 times when I was in college (they came to Columbus a LOT). But I do like Husker Du and had to have that single.
As a native Minnesotan, I watched all the MTM shows. (The MPLS setting of course).That song you mentioned was "Love is all around" by Sonny Curtis. Why I have remembered that I have no idea!
Three thoughts:
1. I'm not down on night one of the Convention. Tim's disappointment kind of surprised me, as I think it was just a kickoff. And having Biden and Clinton there, to me was, you know, getting the Old Guard in and out of the program (same as the Obama's tonight, although I think they still have great appeal and create excitement).
2. I think it would be great if Adam Kinzinger ran in Texas, but wouldn't it be better if he ran as an Independent? It might give him more appeal to moderate Rs and undecided voters.
3. Beto was criticizing the more political parts of efforts in TX (and elsewhere) and in general (fundraising, candidate selection, etc). I think what he's doing is absolutely essential for electoral success. But I think both, working in tandem, would lead to optimal success for Dems. Is his method of having a beer and talking to people in underserved communities? Hell, yes. Good on him for doing it. I wish the party did more of it.
Texas sure is frustrating. It is getting less red with each election cycle. But they keep reelecting such doorknobs as Cruz, Abbott and Paxton with all the problems they have.(horrible electrical grid, mass shootings) As Sarah once said;"Don't mess with Texas".A couple of years ago, (after the Uvaldi shooting) Mathew McConneghey was thinking of running for Governor. Maybe that is what it takes.(a celebrity)
My first duty station was in Texas, when Ann Richards was governor. I'm sad it has gotten to this. I feel sorry for the people of Texas!
Ann Richards, now there was a governor! Remember her line about George Bush: "Poor George.He was born with a silver spoon in his mouth".
I thought it was silver foot.
Great comments and wholeheartedly agree!
I lived in Texas for the better part of 10 years, and I really like Beto. Even if he didn’t win, the work he did/does to build up Dems in TX is important. We all owe him our gratitude.
Plus he gave me an opportunity to see Willie Nelson in concert because he played Betos rally in Austin :)
Stacey Abrahams didn't win either, but she paved the way for Georgia to become a purple state :)
Great interview Tim! One of the best you have done in a bit. Of course I love Beto and live in Texas - and yeah I really thought he was going to squeak by and pummel the odious Ted Cruz. Beto worked his tail off. I saw him on the stump (sitting in the front row) and he was crazy electric. This interview inspired me to get involved again. And hell yeah, come run here in Texas Adam Kinzinger! So happy to see Kinzinger on the Bulwark team (and please do some more conversational pods with him - enjoy you two together).
Oh no, an indulgent convention.
Alert the media.
Thanks for all the work you do in Texas, Beto!! We need all the help we can get!!
To this "ancient' 70-something, Beto reminds me of Jerry Brown a smart pol, (son of a popular former CA governor) who understood that "all politics are local." (Tip O'Neil - Boston Congressman)
~ former Jesuit Seminarian,
~ California Sec'y of State,
~ 2x Governor of California, in the late 1970s and early 1980s.
~ Mayor of Oakland
The reason Jerry was popular because he was considered a proponent of strict fiscal issues (pissing off Liberals) and liberal in personal choices (pissing off Conservatives).
Jerry went off on a journey of personal discovery after his state political career, came back to Cali and was elected Mayor of Oakland, CA. Kamie's hometown.
The intellectual understanding of politics that Jerry had sounds like Beto today.
BTW - Jerry was politically connected to both San Fran pol Willie Brown (no relation) who was average in height and political power broker and LA City Council member Nate Holden (well over six feet).
But as the Racist-In-Chief might say "When on a helicopter headed to the ground, all those 'kelerd' people look the same to me."
Unfortunately that doesn’t work anymore. Culture has massively trumped good governance unfortunately
Jerry Brown is the person whom Beto reminds me of the most. They have that same vibe about them.
Strong agree about Jason Isbell. Caught a fantastic concert last year at Wolf Trap. And I remember his wife, Amanda Shires, was on one of your podcasts about the same time. Love 'em both.
They’re getting divorced. Isbell initiated that. Sad to see that, but they both live on the road and seem firmly wedded to their music. Seems more pragmatism than acrimony.
Isbell live surprised me. His studio work is folk and country, but the live shows have a healthy dose of rock’n’roll that reminds me very much of a Tom Petty concert. And that’s high praise.
I'm worried there might be some SDS (Shapiro) at the Bulwark because there's been a fair amount of negativity since the Veep pick (and while if she loses PA and the election, I will accept the non-stop I told you so). And cut Joe some slack: what he did was hard and unprecedented. He didn't have to do a damn thing, and most people in power would not have done it.
She made the perfect decision.
I’m not sure SHAPIRO wanted to be VP as badly as The Bulwark wanted him to be VP.
I mentioned this before but the interview with Shapiro didn't go well. And the decision on Shapiro was mutual. The interview with Walz sealed the deal. Walz also said he was close to the end of his political career. Plus there is the chemistry aspect.
No Republican wants to fix immigration or the border. First, they don’t want brown people coming (replacement theory) and second, they realize that scaring people garners more votes than governing.
Why does Cruz keep getting reelected? Because most Republican voters now believe that the worst Republican is better than the best Democrat because Democrats hate America.
You tend to be where I am. First, no democratic president will waste the political capital necessary to pass immigration reform because (1) it won’t pass no matter how much political capital they expend (see every president since Regan) and (2) even if it did pass it would take YEARS to implement and said president wouldn’t be re-elected because “he didn’t do anything for me.”
Great conversation! Couple of observations and compliments. I feel like you and Beto are practically doppelgängers (you being the prettier one, Tim) and I appreciate Beto's choice of The Replacements or Husker Du - great choice by you for their cover of Love Is All Around to close out the show. As to last nights's DNC, I'm glad I wasn't the only one to notice the tan suit. Epic sartorial troll by Kamala.
Ok Tim, gotta disagree with you about Jason Isbell. He is 100% not "pop country", which is what Nashville churns out. He is the real thing, whether with his current band or with his former band, the Drive-By Truckers. You want a label, call it "alt country" or Americana. Speaking of the Drive-By Truckers, check out their song "What It's Like". Zach Bryan is popular, agreed, but I agree with Steve Spillette below. He is not pop country. I'm just really disappointed that Beto didn't mention a fellow Texan, James McMurtry. The guy is phenomenal. For a long time I have wished that the Democrats would have adopted his song "We Can't Make It Here" as a campaign theme. I always thought Democrats were supposed to be for the working man, etc., and I became an independent when it became glaringly apparent that was no longer the case. Also, I'm basically a center left guy. Now, for a really fun song by James, listen to "Choctaw Bingo", specifically the live version on his album "Live in Aught-Three".
i love isbell and have played him several times on the pod, was talking about ZB. And I'm sorry if you are headlining Cowboy Stadium you are pop country !
Fair enough. I would love to hear your thoughts about James McMurtry
BTW, Harris and Walz give me hope that the Democrats may move more to the center.
I'm Texan. For those unfamiliar with Texas, allow me to explain why many of us stubborn fuckers do not want to leave.
There are two Texases. There's big city Texas and there's rural Texas.
Big city Texas is moderate democrat (Biden and Beto won each of the four big counties, which house Houston, Dallas/FtWorth, San Antonio, and Austin), with around 20 million people in total. It is incredibly diverse in terms of population, with Houston beating out even NYC I believe for diversity, and fairly well integrated socially, as there are a ton of interracial and intercultural marriages. There are a ton of diverse cultural experiences one can have -- markets that strongly resemble actual markets in Mexico, lunar new year festivals, Chinese theater, etc. The food is amazing. The people are great. Basically, Big City Texas is 20-30 years ahead of most places, and shows what a vibrant multi-racial society can be.
Oh, and Big City Texas is still (comparatively) affordable. For the price of a 1 bedroom shit-shack in San Francisco, you could have a 5000sq ft house in a nice neighborhood in a nice neighborhood.
This is why we don't want to abandon. To me, to us, THIS is Texas.
Ok, and now there's rural Texas. Other than certain specific areas, rural Texas is what you think it is. Pure Trump country. The deep south.
And then there's just some Texan things in general to be proud of. Like alcohol? I'm not sure if any state has the diversity of locally produced alcohol that we do. Countless breweries, countless distilleries, and even a decent variety of wineries (California clearly beats us in the wine category though). Like locally made food products? We have a ton. Want to buy a pickup truck designed in Texas by Texans, built in Texas by Texans? Buy a Toyota Tundra (that's right).
I don't want to leave Texas. I want our state government to reflect what the state actually is.
Fuck these assholes.
Just like the rest of the nation; urban is Dem., rural is Rep.
Yes, but most of the nation doesn’t have 4 mega cities.
Houston area — 7.1 million people
Dallas/FtWorth area — 8.1 million people
Austin area — 2.5 million people
San Antonio area — 2.6 million people
Makes the whole thing extra galling.
Florida has a similar type of shit show going on.
Same as California. Exactly the same. Stockton and Bakersfield are trump country. San Francisco, San Jose, la, and sd all blue. Same for every state.
I agree, good grief Tim! All conventions are indulgent but at least this wasn’t over the top misogynistic! Kid Rock? Hulk Hogan (who struggled to rip the shirt off his hyper-steroidal body). It was looonnnnggggg - but kind and emotional.
The repub one was definitely GROSS! DJT walking into the song "It's a Man's World" tells us all we need to know about that side (along with all of that other silly "masculinity" on display). I'm down for all of the fuzzy, feel-good indulgence of the Democratic Convention!
It was looooonnnnny.
I wouldn't call Zach Bryan "pop country" - he's very popular, but not a creature of Nashville.
Is this the guy that stole PeeWee’s bike?? https://www.instagram.com/p/C-c8p26scrJ/?igsh=MTdjanE5b2MxbnI0aw==
Also looks like Biff in "Back to the Future"
Oh no! A former Republican found the first night of the DNC to be indulgent! Oh man!
Good grief, Tim.
To some degree, I agree with Tim.
The only "prime scripted speakers" worthwhile:
1. Most Entertaining: Jasmine Crockett - great combo of script (the "V" alliteration was great) and personal her story with Kammie.
2. Most Real Experience: AOC - as a former bartender, I was heartened by her "roots" story, especially being on one's feet for 8+hours.
3. Senator Reverend Raphael Warnock - Nothing better than the speechifying by Black pastors.
4. Hillary (she knew this was also her Swan Song), so she shined in poise and fury. She especially turned the knife in Trump...who we know was watching.
That said --- "Coach" Steve Kerr was a wonderful palette cleanser (a term Tim is wont to use)
I would add UAW President Shawn Fain, Michigan State Senator Mallory McMorrow on Project 2025, and the three women who fearlessly told their abortion stories.
The party just made a switch and bypassed the sitting incumbent. A night to celebrate him is completely in order. Especially considering how consequential this administration was. There was nothing indulgent about it. If the critique was, let’s shorten the speeches, that’s at least reasonable. This isn’t.
Tim, can you have Chris Christie back on to tell us if he's voting for Kamala?
Nah.Chris Christie will do the brave thing and put in Reagan's name. :)
And every member of Trump's Cabinet who are not backing him.