The Bulwark
The Next Level
The Tabloid Candidate
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Current time: 0:00 / Total time: -56:57
-56:57

The Tabloid Candidate

Next Level audio edition.

David Pecker’s testimony in Trump's trial highlights how his lies and misinformation dominated his 2016 campaign. And Marco Rubio's pathetic attempt to become Trump's veep has led him to vote against funding for Ukraine, but the gang is pretty sure conservative "normies" will eat the selection up.

Plus, the potential for RFK Jr. to hurt Trump, rather than Biden, the reason why foreign aid finally got done, and protests at Columbia University.

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Discussion about this episode

User's avatar
Parrhizzia's avatar

One requirement of Zionism is the absolute need to lie for the benefit of Zionism, including making libellous claims about the opponents of Zionism.

In this podcast, at the 43 minute mark, Tim Miller says "These protests about Jonathan Chait's thing was right about how all you have to do is read what the Students for Palestine say in their own manifestos ... whatever you want to call it, and they're like, they basically want to kill Jews ... that's what the leaders of these groups say".

They basically want to kill Jews, Tim? Really?

Here is a link to the Students for Justice in Palestine "manifesto". In no way does it say they want to "kill Jews":

https://www.nationalsjp.org/about

What they actually say is: "We promote an agenda grounded in freedom, solidarity, equality, safety, and historical justice". If you squint really hard, that sounds like a conservative ideology.

I hope Miller will retract this libellous statement and apologize to the SJP. Perhaps even have one of their leaders on the podcast to discuss their aspirations?

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Eric Levinson's avatar

There have always been outrageous comments and accusations about political opponents.

One apocryphal (I hope) story about Lyndon Johnson:

Johnson wanted to put out a story that his opponent had fornicated with hogs. An aide said “You can’t call him a Pig Fucker.” Johnson replied “I just want to see him deny it.”

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Daniel Takash's avatar

I thought that JVL was doing an Alex Jones impression at the start of the show.

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srmduke87's avatar

These campus protests are the new "immigrant caravans" for the right

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Tony Singleton's avatar

JVL is spot on about RFK Jr. I know two-time Trump voters who are interested for exactly the same reasons JVL mentioned.

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Sherm's avatar

JVL sounds like a guy who works in a mechanic's shop that does a brisk business in auto parts and who is weirdly insistent that he needs to carry brass knuckles everywhere.

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Reldas's avatar

I agree 100% with everything y'all said about the campus protests, with one huge caveat. Governor Hot Wheels is (psychotic) elated to finally have an excuse to send his troops onto the UT campus to f*ck-up some elitist libtards.

Texas and Tennessee are in a war for who can become the first truly fascist state. I tell anyone who will listen that the two most heavily armed and deadly borders on earth are TX/Mexico and N/S Korea. None of the other border governors have done what Hot Wheels has done.

Thank you for being honest and truthful about the state of the world. Texas is not a safe place to be.

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Gail R Kelso's avatar

Regarding Rubio, has Marc Caputo discussed the impact a VP of hispanic descent could have on the election?

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Will Baetz's avatar

Cruz fingered Pecker!!!!

Sorry, apparently I’m 12

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DH's avatar

Hope JVL feels better - the voice was amazing though, especially when talking about David Pecker

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azlefty's avatar

Regarding the Enquirer being a party organ: Is this really unique in American history? It's been a long time since I learned about this in high school and college, but I thought it was pretty common until the 1950s or so for newspapers to actively support particular parties and/or policy, often fabricating content to that end. The example that comes to mind is Hearst and Pulitzer essentially fabricating the motivation for the Spanish American War. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish%E2%80%93American_War#US_response)

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Bruce Lawrence's avatar

In the past, partisan newspapers proudly proclaimed their political loyalties. The National Enquirer was doing stealth partisanship.

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Travis's avatar

Don't worry too much about going hard on the cough medicine JVL, worst that'll happen is you'll catch a nice "robo-trip" like I used to when I was 13/14 lol. And you guys should hit the constitution center in Philly if you've never been!

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Chris's avatar

Every time I hear the name "David Pecker" I can't help but crack up laughing. Also, he looks exactly like the Pringles can guy.

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azlefty's avatar

I thought he was Geraldo Rivera.

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Travis's avatar

Did not know that the National Inquirer ran fake stories about Ted Cruz sleeping with Amanda--because I wasn't onto the Bulwark & Co until sometime in 2018. What a piece of shit David Pecker is. Now I'm big mad.

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Cristen Reat's avatar

JVL- you may not have noticed in your current Darth Vader state, but Sarah references your newsletter! Great discussion about the protesters. I do think a key element of this is what Sarah often discusses and that is LEADERSHIP matters. These young people have seen the most terrible behavior from elected leaders, celebrities, and supposedly serious people. As Sarah points out, what about a forum where people discuss disagreements civilly? What ever happened to that? I saw that my alma mater, UT Austin, arrested a bunch of out of control protesters in the last 2 days. Abbott condemned it, and it is about the only thing I have ever agreed with him on!

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James F.'s avatar

Marco Rubio is indeed the worst, and I greatly regret hoping he'd be the GOP's nominee in 2016. He's perhaps the biggest phony out there. I'm rooting hard for Marco to be picked as the VP, resign his Senate seat and move to, like, Georgia, and then lose to the Biden/Harris ticket. It's what he deserves.

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Ellen Hinchee's avatar

Great episode. I hadn’t really thought through the craziness of what David Pecker has been describing on the witness stand. But good grief, it’s completely nuts and not at all normal. The NE essentially made up the story about Ted Cruz and then Trump amplified it for his own advantage in the 2016 primary. It’s the same exact formula as the first impeachment issues, over Ukraine, and the attempted hijacking of DOJ after the 2020 election - “just say there are problems and the R congressmen and I will take it from there.” Are any of his fans paying attention??? Also I am becoming more and more dismayed by these fancy colleges. They’re turning out people like Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley but also these bratty kids currently on their campuses, with their entitlement and their manufactured rage. How many of them really have a full understanding of the issues? Or is this just fashionable?

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

So let me get this straight...Dems "promoting" MAGA candidates in primaries, like in Michigan, is bad. But Dems "promoting" RFK, Jr is good.

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Tim Miller's avatar

Yeah pretty easy to explain RFK Jr. isn't going to win and be president.

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Marnie Rapaport's avatar

I am old as dirt so the Kennedy name resonates. But I would love young folk to weigh in on this. Any real idea re Camelot and all it entailed? And if they do know about the spell cast, how could this Kennedy possibly hold any appeal for Dems? Long way to agree he’s pulling from Trump.

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

But he could take enough votes away from Biden to make Trump president. That's been one of the fears about RFK, right?

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Tim Miller's avatar

Don't have time to go round and round on this at the moment think you are misunderstanding our points will address on a future ep. -Tim

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

Thanks for the time you could give. 👍

I can't imagine how busy you must always be with the writing, podding, tv'ing, dadding and husbanding.

I came to The Bulwark for Charlie, but stayed for the community you gals and guys are growing.

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Pauline Francis's avatar

I figured that the R's coming out to endorse Trump were doing so bc Trump had 'endorsed' or at least agreed to follow the guidance of the 2025 project and The Federalist Society and Leonard Leo et al on not just the transition but also the policy guidance contained in the 2025 project document. I assumed that the R's were taking Trump at his word on this like they did on his statement to appt judges from the Federalist Society bc Trump did follow through on on that promise for judges. If indeed Trump is NOT going to do as he said he would do, giving preference to 'loyalists' vetted by Eric and Donald Jr., then why would the R's support him? There really is no other platform or policy position for the next Trump administration other than retribution without the 2025 project etc. Also, on the theory that to 'follow the money' is always a good idea, I also would assume that the big bucks behind whatever Leonard Leo decides to do would be persuasive for Eric and Donald Jr in deciding who is loyal and who is not. So, I guess it will come down to how much money Leonard Leo is willing to share with Trump and his sons when it comes to their following guidance from Leonard Leo et al? Trump will want a 'taste', and it's just a matter of how much.

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KDoubleC's avatar

I looooooove you guys, TNL is my favorite podcast and gets me excited for Wednesdays days in advance. With that said I have a critique of both Tim and Sarah’s take on what is happening on campuses across the country.

To Tim’s point that the free market is there to correct for extremism in elite colleges, this doesn’t take into account how the market is unable to actually level the field in this way. This isn’t a situation where if you don’t like the taste or politics of Sprite you can switch to another lime soda or even where the premier luxury electric car company can see it’s societal status, and therefore stock, altered so quickly based on the decisions of its leader. Elite colleges are so culturally powerful they are immune from such an approach. Harvard will be Harvard no matter how much bad press or scandals they acquire. They are, in a real sense, too big to fail.

With this in mind, I find it unreasonable, unfair, and unhealthy to have the expectation that if you are comfortable with Jew hatred and extremist left wing ideology then the places that basically print the easiest access to the most lucrative professions (medicine, law, finance, and consulting) and culturally impactful jobs (journalism, media, high level bureaucratic positions) are a fit for you, but if you aren’t then go somewhere with far fewer post-graduation advantages on offer.

To Sarah’s point that this could be a teachable moment taken advantage of by college admin or faculty, this misses the major point: at least a plurality of admins and many many professors are the originators or main propagators of this dangerous radicalism. The toxic extreme identitarian ideology that these kids are spouting didn’t come to be organically, but through these institutions by design. If these schools had internal sentries holding against these ideas en masse we wouldn’t be here right now. Like the GOP, many are simply cowards, but many more are true believers.

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Bruce Lawrence's avatar

Case in point: Eight of our nine current Supreme Court justices went to law school at Harvard or Yale. Both parties privilege elite schools in their judicial appointments. If we want more diversity of the kind that matters, we need affirmative action for graduates of non-Ivy colleges in judicial appointments.

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Kate Schlesinger's avatar

Completely agree. It also seems strange to dismiss these as "not that many people, in a few isolated locations." Charlottesville was also not that many people in one isolated location, and it was still scary! This kind of vicious hatred is scary, even if it is just college kids, particularly, as you note, when they're the ones who will have disproportionate societal power in a few years.

The gang also suggests they should protest presidential events instead, seeming to forget that there was a huge anti-Israel protest at Biden's big fundraiser. The crowd screamed "fucking murderous kike" at one woman as she left the event. It's not just college campuses.

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KDoubleC's avatar

Honestly, I wish they would just call us “kikes” and get it over with. It with be less pernicious and more intellectually honest than turning “Zionist” into a dirty word.

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LeftCoastReader's avatar

The discussion about RFKjr makes me wonder if he is about to become everybody's plaything to try to use as a cudgel against the other campaign. Trump would push him to the left as a honeypot for progressive voters, and Biden might take a page from Adam Schiff's playbook and elevate him as the rightful MAGA heir to draw voters away from Trump on the right.

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Christine's avatar

I’m concerned that JVL is dropping actual f-bombs instead of saying “fork.” Don’t get me wrong - I cuss like a sailor, so no judgement here - just want to be sure we aren’t a corrupting force.

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Bruce Lawrence's avatar

It's probably the influence of that cough medicine he's taking . . .

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Christine's avatar

He WAS drinking straight from the bottle...

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Cristiano Sacchi's avatar

So... MAGA had the opportunity to get A LOT of stuff for border security in exchange for the Ukraine+Israel+... package. Instead the Ukraine+Israel+... package passed and they got nothing for the border because Trump wants the border as an issue. Great job!

Now, what if now Biden turns around and puts forward a sensible border+immigration reform?

And with that he takes the lead on border+immigration stealing the issue from Trump...

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Kelly's avatar

JVL, you are the GOAT.

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John's avatar

Before you guys get all gooey over Mike Johnson, can we please recall that that little creeping Jesus was squarely and forthrightly behind the attempt to overturn the lawful 2020 election. If he had had his way, Trump would be president right now. So spare me the “Profiles in Courage” nonsense. Until he recants and repents, he is irredeemable. Period. He is not a normie. Let’s remember who the real enemy is.

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Sara's avatar

For the love of all that is holy, please have JVL do an audiobook recording of ‘50 Shades of Grey’ whilst his voice is still so (sickly) sexy. Puuuuuuurrrrrr.

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Jonathan V. Last's avatar

She handled the bratwurst like a trophy…..

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Lee Newberry Jones's avatar

Get well soon, JVL.

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ET's avatar

Tim and Bibi must have the same PR person, since apparently they both think the point of the Gaza protests is to *checks notes* kill the Jews. It’s the Bulwark’s turn to hide beside the ‘discomfort’ of some (almost like a… human shield?) so as to conveniently keep ignoring Israel’s indiscriminate slaughter. Never mind the fact that Jewish students who participate and organize (and pray and celebrate their faith) among the protester are conveniently erased in this narrative. I love this community ! But wish they could do better, maybe a little less… ‘pedestrian’ on Palestine.

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E2's avatar

It sounds like it's the student protestors who need better "PR people," if the message that's getting out from them is as different from their intentions as you say.

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ET's avatar

Not if they are being intentionally maligned/misinterpreted by the talking heads

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E2's avatar

If someone is misrepresenting you, that makes it even more imperative that you be clear and in careful control of your message.

American student protestors are being seen *around the world* as anti-Israel, shading into antisemitism. They have been photographed with signs calling for the killing of Jews (if in other words) and they have been recorded in similar chants. Pro-Israel counterdemonstrators and others marked as Jews have been verbally abused and hit with thrown objects.

I know that some of this is probably the work of bad-faith agitators, and I'm sure that not every individual protestor agrees with the Jew-killing plan. But that *is* a message they are putting out.

I see that Columbia Students for Justice in Palestine has now disavowed "any form of hate or bigotry" and "inflammatory individuals," but they're now behind the ball. This wasn't in their original statements, and they weren't making any apparent effort at message discipline on the protest line, for the cameras, before this.

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Parrhizzia's avatar

"They have been photographed with signs calling for the killing of Jews (if in other words) and they have been recorded in similar chants"

Provide evidence for this claim, or retract.

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ET's avatar

Condescending tone and over use of *emphasis* aside, your comment just serves to show you’ve applied zero critical thinking to this, and would rather grasp at straws to reinforce your easily-digested worldview .. that they are ‘bad guys.’ Circular logic. All you basically said was, ‘if they’re gonna misrepresent you, don’t let them misrepresent you. Plus the misrepresentation was accurate, by the way, and I think they mostly just wanna kill Jews because ‘that’s the message their putting out’ — my point is that you’re wrong, and happy to erase the Jews (ever-present) who don’t support Israel.

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E2's avatar

Some of the people I'm closest to in the world are Jews who don't support current Israeli policy (but do support Israel). I've been thinking about Israel-Palestine since the 1990s, between the intifadas, when I worked for the American end of a company exporting West Bank olives. Most of the people I worked with were Jews specifically interested in cooperative ventures. It was later put out of business by Israeli regulation.

To the extent that I'm concerned about pro-Palestinian student protestors being misrepresented or co-opted, besides a general interest in truth, it's because I'm sympathetic to the very segment you're talking about here.

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ET's avatar

Maybe a little too zesty for the bulwark comments? You can take the last shot, I won’t respond 😪

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Parrhizzia's avatar

May I take the last shot?

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Maura E Caffrey's avatar

Did I miss something? Isn't it likely that the reason behind Mike Johnson's shining moment is not so much that he grew a conscience and the anatomical parts to back it up but that Defendant and Uber-poster DJT just too tired to annihilate him?

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Margaret Fisher SF Bay Area's avatar

In contrast to your analysis of Mike Johnson and passed legislation, I thought your discussion of the Cease-Fire in Gaza protest at Columbia was pretty simplistic. Although the GOP leaders in Congress highlighted the anti - Semitic actions of a few, (& jumped on this in a very similar way that Trump did during the 2020 BLM protests calling them horrifically violent and calling in the national Guard in Portland,) the protest at Columbia was nonviolent civil disobedience in which many Jewish students participated. Being against Netanyahu's rampage across Gaza is NOT pro Hamas as many are saying, AND also not anti Jewish. It is easy to conflate the two for pushing an agenda, but they are just not the same. The guy who yelled the horrible anti Israel threats was not the majority of students who were nonviolently exercising their commitment to justice. The NYPD reported the students were peaceful: If you take a cursory dismissive view of college students protesting the ongoing killing of civilians in Gaza, I believe you are missing a big piece of what is going to impact our presidential elections. This kind of civil disobedience is what helped end apartheid in S Africa. I also urge you not to confuse pro civilian rights in Gaza with pro Hamas or with anti-Semitic hate. It is the opposite of that. These students were urging the Columbia administration to divest from Netanyahu’s war. I don’t believe ignoring one of the biggest human disasters America has financially and politically supported, makes these future citizens better. It is extremely hard when you are young and idealistic to turn away from the suffering of so many. I appreciate the detailed nuances you provide when analyzing Republican political strategies and hope you can give this topic equal attention.

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Sandy Jaquith's avatar

Speaking of House Speaker Mike Johnson's change of heart on aid to Ukraine, does anyone remember the April Fool's missive filed by Bill Kristol (4/1/24)?

"In a major surprise in the battle over Ukraine funding, House Speaker Mike Johnson stopped outside church after attending Easter Sunday services in Shreveport, Louisiana, to read a statement: “After praying on it, I’ve decided to bring the Ukraine aid package to the floor of the House as soon as we reconvene in a week. Moses stepped up to confront tyranny in his day, and I’m going to follow his example. We can’t sit on our hands and just offer thoughts and prayers as brave men and women fight for freedom.” God job, Bll!

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Different drummer's avatar

I'd forgotten until AB brought it up on Just B/t Us w/ Mona.

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ananaya's avatar

I forgot about that! Life imitates snark.

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Sandy Jaquith's avatar

Great comment :)

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Kathy Boelte's avatar

My thought too.

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Tim Miller's avatar

Yay Bill !

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JohnnyZee32's avatar

OMG I felt bad for JVL, I couldn’t help but laugh, Tim saying the sponsor wouldn’t want the ad read done by Bane dropped me to the floor LOL. Heal up JVL

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Eli G's avatar

Helpful thoughts about the protests happening on some college campuses —excellent idea about going to UN with signs.

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Jen's avatar

JVL almost cost me my teenage daughter. To set the scene, she leaves work by the rear exit which opens into a parking garage. She’s had some weird experiences taking out the trash there so she’s primed to be wary.

I’m listening to the pod as I wait to pick her up. Out of the corner of my eye, I see her open the car door and then all of a sudden she jumps, panics and starts to curl up in a ball. What the heck??!! Turns out, she heard JVL on my car speakers and freaked out thinking there was an axe murderer behind her in the garage. 😂😂

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Colleen Kochivar-Baker's avatar

Eric and Don as loyalty czars is pretty funny except daddy has pretty much lost them their inheritance and business future in NY. They have to find something to do in the new family gig. Probably jealous as hell of Jared who got out bigly rich while the grifting was good.

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Joshua Fletcher's avatar

JVL saying "Phillyyyyyy" in his low voice at the end of this show is going to be my new ringtone.

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Kelly Ireland's avatar

I think Mike Johnson is realizing Joe Biden is a nice guy. I think he's met with Biden and Biden was nice to him. As humans, it's hard, especially when the righteous case is clear (Ukraine, e.g.), to hold your stubborn ground when someone is genuinely making an effort to collaborate.

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AJS's avatar

When did the Bulwark invent a time machine and bring Barry White back to life to host a podcast?

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jpg's avatar

RFKJr pulls together the Goopy left along with the anti vaccine/Qanon right.

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MelissaL's avatar

“Pecker” in that voice turned me into an immature middle schooler!! (Insert Beavis and Butthead laugh)🤣🤣

Not to take away from the seriousness of the real issue being discussed!

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azlefty's avatar

Regarding the David Pecker testimony: the catching and killing apparently is an illegal in-kind campaign contribution - on the part of David Pecker, who admitted to these crimes under an immunity agreement. Not discussed in the podcast was whether it amounts to a crime on the part of Donald Trump. The prosecution so far has been very circumspect about the actual crime that this testimony demonstrates.

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SETH HALPERN's avatar

Love the "C curve" idea. But only for MIT, Caltech, Swarthmore, U. Chicago and Hopkins.) Nowhere else could hope to stay in business.

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Jonathan V. Last's avatar

This is why we had no campus activism at JHU.

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azlefty's avatar

Would all of this legislation have passed if Trump hadn't been in a courtroom in NYC? I wonder how much this takes away his attention from tracking the fealty of members of the House of Representatives.

Also, regarding Mike Johnson: I suspect he may have a Paul Ryan style attitude toward serving as the Speaker. He didn't want the job in the first place, so that gives him a lot more leverage than someone who wanted it since he ran for president of his high school student council. So why not do the right thing? Especially when your overseer, for the first time in a long time, seems to have other fish to fry.

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Maura E Caffrey's avatar

Exactly my thoughts!

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Al Brown's avatar

I mostly agree. In addition, when he thinks "if they boot me, who's going to replace me?", he probably comes up blank, like I do. A lot of power comes from that.

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azlefty's avatar

And he could threaten to resign his seat if deposed, reducing the Republican edge to zero seats?

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John Kendrick's avatar

Great podcast! The news about David Pecker and the National Enquirer was very fascistic. Glad that is out in public now. Also, interesting discussion about RFK, Jr. - emphasizing the craziness of his positions is a good way to keep borderline Biden voters for voting for him, while also sort of encouraging Trump voters to vote RFK, Jr, to own the libs or whatever.

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tupper's avatar

Will Isaac Hayes be a regular going forward. Next time can he sing?

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Jim Tung's avatar

OMG JVL - just go to bed, man. It's awesome that you were playing hurt, but /dude./

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Dave Yell's avatar

When it comes to speculation that Vance or Marco are VP possibilities I think Chicago said it best;"Does anybody really know what time it is? Does anybody really care?"

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Al Brown's avatar

The video link in the text takes us to the wrong video --"The 1860s are back"

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CT's avatar

I can't get over JVL's voice on this one. I LOVE it!!!!!! It's pure comedy

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Paul A. Tonkin's avatar

Facts, the truth, integrity surpass any and all political party affiliations.

We are Americans first above all else. We must take our duty as citizens seriously.

So many good people have sacrificed everything so we can live in this United States.

We must never betray their legacy. Left right male female dark skinned light skinned WE ARE AMERICANS, LETS ACT LIKE IT AND BE THE LEADER OF THE WORLD WITH TOLERANCE COMPASSION AND CARING!

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Dave Yell's avatar

Regarding Cruz and Rubio,JVL mentioned "How they can look themselves in the mirror" when it has come out what Pecker,Trump and the National enquirerer did.to them? To which I will add; how little dignity and self respect must they have of themselves?

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Jesse Ewiak's avatar

On the RFK voters thing -

Robert F. Kennedy voters in forced two-way presidential election via national Quinnipiac poll:

47% Trump

29% Biden

8% wouldn't vote

6% someone else

6% undecided

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Saba Anvery's avatar

JVL, it is very difficult to take you seriously with that voice.

Feel better soon!

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Dave Yell's avatar

He sounded like one of those WWE wrestlers.

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Jessica Margolin's avatar

Chancellor Christ did a great job shutting down the garbage at UC Berkeley 7 yrs ago (a public university).

Background: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2017/08/15/free-speech-focus-christ-starts-year-berkeleys-chancellor

Event (scroll to bottom, read up): https://news.berkeley.edu/campus-update-on-free-speech-week

It's worse this time around, because there are explicitly anti-semitic attacks on faculty and visiting speakers, but fundamentally that's the approach that works with students.

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Marnie Rapaport's avatar

I’ve seen posts that say stuff like “it’s just a few people shouting death to Jews” so chill. Because I am a MOT, because my son is in Haifa, because so many of my husband’s family were put to death in Poland, and because my MIL was one of Lena’s children, I check them out. Granted, you can only tell so much by a name, but I have never come across an obviously MOT telling me to chill. And when I think about stuff like that being shouted at my kids when they were younger and in college, I hope those “protesters” are expelled. There are limits on the First Amendment, and even more so at private colleges. The administrations need better lawyers.

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Gordon's avatar

Sarah,

Please consider asking Congresswoman Fletcher TX-07 to appear. She is a Kenyon Owl.

With gratitude from Houston,

Gordon

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Meghan R's avatar

Could not agree more with all of you on the student protests. We should be teaching these students how to have productive conversations with people they do not agree with and construct well, thought out arguments then just let them camp out in tents and yell for days on end. When I was in undergrad (which wasn’t that long ago) I had 15 to 18 hours of class, plus I worked and served as a volunteer tutor for a few hours every week. Whatever free time was left was for friends/college shenanigans. Protesting in a tent for days on end would have been completely off my radar.

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Bruce Lawrence's avatar

In my experience, campus protest events are better attended on days when the weather is pleasant.

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Dave Yell's avatar

Completely agree.Plus Remember,the protest on some college campuses across the country are a very small, very loud minority.But it doesn't s appear that way.Also, the most vocal attract attention in our culture.As the saying goes; if it bleeds ,it leads.

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Al Brown's avatar

In a lot of cases, I'm afraid that by the time a person gets into a top university, if s/he hasn't already learned how valuable it is "to have productive conversations with people they do not agree with and construct well, thought out arguments", that horse is already out of the barn. Not that it isn't still worth trying.

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Dave Yell's avatar

Which end of that horse?

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Jesse Ewiak's avatar

Have you considered for a lot of these people, this is hanging out with their friends?

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Dave Yell's avatar

I saw on the news about it at U of Minnesota in front of Coffman Union.It looked to me like most students were onlookers between classes.And there weren't that many anyway.

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Meghan R's avatar

Totally and I don’t deny that’s part of it.

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Jesse Ewiak's avatar

My actual opinion is the well yes, there's a group of people who had to work and such during college, most people from elite college complaining about other current students at elite colleges are either highly overestimating how much time they actually they spend studying, dorks (that's me), or STEM weirdos. I'd actually bet most of the people currently protesting probably do spend more than the median time doing schoolwork, and that's part of the reason they're protesting.

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Al Brown's avatar

Just out of curiosity, what brings you to the conclusion that "most of the people currently protesting probably do spend more than the median time doing schoolwork"? Seems like a reach to me.

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Robert Curtiss's avatar

Sarah,

Bat Boy was "The Weekly World News." You're defaming a serious journalistic effort like WWNews by confusing it with Pecker's scurulous rag.

~Robert Curtiss

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Bruce Lawrence's avatar

Why waste your time on celebrity gossip when you could be reading about space aliens?

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Janna's avatar

Thank you for correcting this, I loved reading WWN. It was hilarious, and the Big Foot Crossword was epic.

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Robert Curtiss's avatar

My favorite headline was the guy whose exploded while he was in the barber's chair.

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Dave Yell's avatar

WARNING: sarcasm alert

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Lisa French's avatar

I enjoyed JVL’s impression of Will Arnett! But seriously, hope you feel better soon, JVL. I’ve had a similar virus twice in the last 6 months. Patron…er, I mean COUGH SYRUP does help. And, I can’t make up my mind about who RFK hurts more and y’all aren’t helping. I was really hoping he wouldn’t be able to get on the ballot in all states.

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Pauline Francis's avatar

Didn't Fox News work hand in glove with the Trump?

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Denis M.'s avatar

I always liked Charles Munger's approach to debate in that to really hold an opinion you should understand the other side's argument better than they do.

In Philly, spend a few hours taking in the collection at the Barnes Foundation and then head to Dalessandro's for the best cheesesteak in town.

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Robert Curtiss's avatar

Go to Chubby's Steaks — right near Dallesandro's but better!

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Denis M.'s avatar

Yep. I prefer Dallesandro’s but it’s close and I have no problem walking across the street if one if too crowded.

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Pauline Francis's avatar

I'm with ya Tim on Marco! I wanna see him out of office by his own hand - for him to voluntarily resign his Senate seat, in favor of a possible VP nom from Trump who gives him the thumb down, in the end, in favor of Kristi Noem! lolol Marco gets beat by a girl from SD! lolol

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Mike's avatar

Macho Man Randy Savage on today’s pod. Best TNL pod ever!

Just needed Sarah playing Roddy Piper!

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Dave Yell's avatar

I was trying to figure out what wrestler he sounded like,after I stopped laughing.

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Charles Repine's avatar

I make this joke every time, but what a huge get to have Will Arnett host the podcast.

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Migs's avatar

“Republicans want the craziest son of the bitch in the room.”

So damn true. You can stop all political analysis with that basic fact/statement

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Dave Yell's avatar

"He may be son of a bitch.But he is our son of a bitch". *Harry S Truman

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Migs's avatar

Jvl is always thoughtful about looking around corners but man did he nail it with this basic statement a while ago.

A Republican gets up and says “I’m going to run the government with prudence. I’m going to balance the budget and turn this country around by bringing it back to its roots.”

The second Republican stands up and says “I’m going to bomb Mexico. I’m going hunting when I’m in DC…for RINO CUCKS and liberal fascist pedos. I’m going to drain the swamp by nuking it!!!!”

Republican voters: “fuck Republican number 1. Kill that lib RINO. GIVE ME ALL OF REPUBLICAN NUMBER 2!!!!! Me want some REAL REPUBLICANS!!!”

6 months later the Republican voter “I don’t understand why washington doesn’t work.”

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Elana Bryan's avatar

Hey! You guys had Harvey Fierstein on the show! Cool.

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Dave Yell's avatar

JVL,After a minute I simply had to stop because I was laughing my head off.Sorry! Whenever I get a cold my voice gets so low I make Lurch sound like a soprano. "You rang".Get well.Now I will proceed to watch in full.

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Jill Boyer-Lehnert's avatar

A little off topic but I was listening to a British “The Rest is Politics” podcast and Rory Stuart and Alistair Campbell announced they are going to have a new podcast on Fridays that will cover just the American Election. Katy Kay will be hosting it and she said she would love to get Sarah Longwell as a guest. Please do it Sarah!

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max skinner's avatar

I feel for you JVL. Sometimes it seems that the mucus collects around the vocal cords creating that feeling that there is a golf ball or even a tennis ball in the throat. The voice deepens and then disappears for a few days. I've learned the hard way not to force the speaking; it only prolongs the problem. Tea with bourbon and honey mixed in doesn't cure anything but does make you feel better.

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Mike's avatar

Max your definition of “cure” is too strict.

That elixir is magic.

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Travis's avatar

JVL's voice is coming in for me somewhere between Edgar from the first Men in Black movie and Michael Keaton's Beetlejuice.

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Lisa French's avatar

lol! Totally! I was like … I know that voice! The best I could come up with was Will Arnett but you nailed it.

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Jonathan V. Last's avatar

Sounds about right. It doesn’t feel good to talk.

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Mike's avatar

Lemon honey tea, JVL. Hang in there.

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Jonathan V. Last's avatar

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Travis's avatar

Sorry dude, I hope you get better soon.

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Tricia Simpson's avatar

Maybe everything really does happen the way it’s supposed to in the universe. After listening to the coverage of the first two days of Pecker testimony — regardless of final legal outcome — this trial going first might be perfect. It reminds everyone what was happening at this point in the 2016 campaign at the almost equivalent point in the 2024 campaign. We were shocked by the appalling, vulgar and possibly criminal behavior then, but now we know it was completely premeditated and intentional. Maybe this is just the information we need now to turn enough people away.

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Rebecca K's avatar

Well, Actually.....

Being the annoying historian here: a newspaper being basically a mouthpiece for a politician/political party isn't new at all, it's just how newspapers worked for decades back in the mid-1800s. Abraham Lincoln literally bought a printing press for a newspaper and said "if we win you can keep this." (link at bottom for all that)

That being said, all this happened in a context where unbiased journalism wasn't a thing yet, and everyone knew the newspapers were telling things through a partisan lens (and a certain event happened in the middle of that time range that rather shows how dangerous this shit is) It happening now is rather more....AHHHHHHHHHH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myaNPg1TV-M

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Pauline Francis's avatar

I'm skeptical of the Trump boys as loyalty czars too. Sounds like something from The Sopranos. So long as they get their cut, they'll be fine.

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Teddy’s Mom's avatar

I just can’t believe they’d be good at it. It sounds like Daddy want to make sure they have good paying jobs but I can’t imagine them being successful at pretty much anything.

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