Enough with the criticism of Biden's pardon for his son ! The whole sorry mess should never have happened. He paid his back taxes . As for the gun, revoke his right to have a gun license, This could have been handled in a very straight forward manner . but no, the maggats insisted upon blowing it all up.
Biden was right to pardon his son. Right on both human compassion and legal fronts. Right to put his unending concern for "norms" behind him. I hope he'll broaden his actions to aggressive pardons for all who might be mowed under by the Trumpco gang and to any executive actions that can legally help protect our democracy. Those of you Bulwarkians residing in the "no pardons" rooms better open up your windows, sniff the air, take a good look at where we are: the autocrats won, they're moving into D.C. and they're going to be on a rampage. It's time to drop politeness and batten down the hatches.
In the explosion of high moral dudgeon about the Biden pardon, which shrivels in importance to Trump's naming his own Lavrentiy Beria, too many people took their eye off the ball.
I guess I can live with people indulging in their Two Minute Hate of Biden as long as we can all get back to the real threats. Your post is a useful corrective.
And come to think of it, I'm coming to the opinion that the anger isn't about the pardon per se but the release of pent-up anger towards Biden for his role in the events that led us to getting Trump again. A very human reaction to be sure, but it's time to put such things away and reengage with the task that we've been handed.
I think the Bulwark has been consistent with their opinions and outrage on use of pardons, so my problem is not with anyone here. My opinion of this is practical that Biden thinks, and based on precedent, that his son has and will be targeted above others under Trump. If he did this if Kamala Harris won, I'd probably would still be apathic but less so. It does sort of broadcast that Biden thinks we will be a lawless society though.
On a separate note on the same topic, the right's complete abuse of power has just made me not care about norms like this. Pardoning Hunter does not impact me in any way. We can all go back and forth when the line was crossed on this. I personally think Hunter has gone through proper punishment and has atoned. But in fairness I'm not a judge or a jury to look at all the evidence.
Four times, now, I have read or listened to a podcast where you all feel compelled to state your opinion about the Hunter Biden pardon. So I feel equally compelled to comment on it for a fourth time. While I don't hold a grudge, and I usually welcome your different opinions, I feel you are way, way off base on this one. As I said in another comment, you are trying to maintain the lofty ideals of norms in the most inappropriate of times. What I sense is that, being Republicans originally, or at least conservatives, you were fond enough of Biden because he had the mojo to beat Trump once. But once he couldn't do that anymore your lack of regard for him is showning through. much the same way I would feel if Reagan were in Biden's place. Now. Can we please not have to read or hear your benighted opinion on this issue anymore? Let's get on with this Administration from Hell and we can all be on the same side again.
The Hunter Biden case is a poster child for the pardon power. It was a miscarriage of justice. If the Biden name wasn’t attached to it, it would be a no-brainer pardon. But, apparently, appearances mean much more than the facts here for many under the Bulwark umbrella. I can only quote Joyce Vance here:
“Just because the trial judges didn’t find selective/vindictive prosecution to the high legal standard required before they can dismiss a case when Hunter Biden’s attorney asked them to do so doesn’t mean the prosecutions weren’t actually tainted by political animus. My office would not have brought these charges, and other former federal prosecutors feel the same way. Former Attorney General Eric Holder tweeted, “Here’s the reality. No US Atty would have charged this case given the underlying facts.” Barb McQuade posted on BlueSky, “Pardon of Hunter Biden is in the best interests of justice. Based on the facts, most federal prosecutors would have declined to charge him.” Former Delaware U.S. Attorney Charlie Oberley, who joined us for “Five Questions” in September 2023 when Hunter Biden’s plea deal fell apart in court said he would not have indicted the case.”
Maybe Tim Miller should have Joyce Vance or Barb McQuade on to discuss the matter.
I hope that most of our Bulwark community will not hold a grudge against some members for stating their beliefs and opinions. Saw some early posts about a few people canceling subscriptions.
I value the fact that We have differing viewpoints and can discuss them intelligently. I have often disagreed with some positions, but have some times also been persuaded to change mine.
Bill was right at the very beginning that Biden should have stepped aside earlier. It took me to that first debate to agree with him. I also did not like the pardon for Hunter, but my dislike is that Joe Biden sprung it upon us with little preparation or explanation. Once again a failure on his part to do the work to sell his decision.
He has always had a little difficulty communicating clearly, but it has gotten much worse as he ages.
He did it, and he had the right to do it. There will be no effect on what Trump does, because he has proven that he will try to do whatever he feels like with no restraint.
The reaction from TB crowd has been very disappointing; have they truly considered the alternative: NOT pardoning Hunter? I think almost every writer / podcaster on here, and I'm guessing most posters, are parents; I have a very hard time imagining that a single one of them would not do the same under the circumstances - which are unprecedented in the U.S.
I highly encourage anyone and everyone to read what the Atlantic Monthly has written about Kash Patel starting with "A Constitutional Crisis greater than Watergate..." and working backwards chronologically. His sycophants zeal literally knows no bougds.
Of course the worse thing begat the bad thing. Patel has spent 4 years railing against Hunter to Steve Bannon and others. Eighty two year old Joe is supposed to feed his son to the wolves..? This isn't a pardon in a vacuum, newsflash. Anyone paying attention can see how the ground had shifted with Trump gearing up to take vindictive power. Focusing on Biden going back on his word is what the Bondi/Patel DoJ want you to say, as they genuflect to Trump's bruised ego and grievances rather than administer
justice on behalf of the people. Joe should pardon more people unfairly in their crosshairs. He has a duty to.
I couldn't read past the fourth iteration of bashing Biden for pardoning his sone who was dragged through themed for 5 years over minor charges that would not have seen the light of day if his name wasn't Biden. Freaking trump pardoned REAL criminals and will certainly pardon J/6 criminals, and himself! Can't see the forest for the trees it seems. This is the same false equivalence, both sides garbage that led to trump winning the election again! Why will the next 4 years be hellish? Because legacy media did the both sides crap. Now you guys are doing it. You might as well compare punching someone in the nose to murder and say that it makes no difference because they are both violent acts. I am not disappointed in Biden, but I am disappointed in your analysis and opinions on this subject....
People who say all Bulwark writers are against the Hunter Biden pardon haven't read the Bulwark.
People who say only Republicans are against the Hunter Biden pardon haven't read the bleeping news.
People who cannot formulate an argument without resorting to insults are not worth listening to.
What the h3ll happened to this comment section, I used to actually learn xit from people here all the time. All earthly good is transitory I guess. Ommmmmmmmmmmm
Sorry. I can't imagine any father or mother doing anything differently than Biden did here. He's 82 years old, and if he didn't step in, he might never see his only surviving son outside prison walls ever again. Nope, it's an easy call.
I agree with you but at the same time I understand Bill's point about how this could undermine our opposition to significant and imminent transgressions from the Trump administration. While I understand and empathize with Biden's decision here I also understand how it can be used to undermine and divide the opposition.
We must not let this happen. We lost this election because we let them divide our coalition over single issues and over 13 million Biden voters sat out this election thereby handing Trump his authoritarian mandate.
No one ever said solidarity was going to be easy, history proves quite the contrary. But when the alternative is an unequivocal devolution into authoritarianism the utilitarian can and must supersede the ideological...
Enough with the criticism of Biden's pardon for his son ! The whole sorry mess should never have happened. He paid his back taxes . As for the gun, revoke his right to have a gun license, This could have been handled in a very straight forward manner . but no, the maggats insisted upon blowing it all up.
Biden was right to pardon his son. Right on both human compassion and legal fronts. Right to put his unending concern for "norms" behind him. I hope he'll broaden his actions to aggressive pardons for all who might be mowed under by the Trumpco gang and to any executive actions that can legally help protect our democracy. Those of you Bulwarkians residing in the "no pardons" rooms better open up your windows, sniff the air, take a good look at where we are: the autocrats won, they're moving into D.C. and they're going to be on a rampage. It's time to drop politeness and batten down the hatches.
Bill, wonderfully said.
In the explosion of high moral dudgeon about the Biden pardon, which shrivels in importance to Trump's naming his own Lavrentiy Beria, too many people took their eye off the ball.
I guess I can live with people indulging in their Two Minute Hate of Biden as long as we can all get back to the real threats. Your post is a useful corrective.
And come to think of it, I'm coming to the opinion that the anger isn't about the pardon per se but the release of pent-up anger towards Biden for his role in the events that led us to getting Trump again. A very human reaction to be sure, but it's time to put such things away and reengage with the task that we've been handed.
I think the Bulwark has been consistent with their opinions and outrage on use of pardons, so my problem is not with anyone here. My opinion of this is practical that Biden thinks, and based on precedent, that his son has and will be targeted above others under Trump. If he did this if Kamala Harris won, I'd probably would still be apathic but less so. It does sort of broadcast that Biden thinks we will be a lawless society though.
On a separate note on the same topic, the right's complete abuse of power has just made me not care about norms like this. Pardoning Hunter does not impact me in any way. We can all go back and forth when the line was crossed on this. I personally think Hunter has gone through proper punishment and has atoned. But in fairness I'm not a judge or a jury to look at all the evidence.
Four times, now, I have read or listened to a podcast where you all feel compelled to state your opinion about the Hunter Biden pardon. So I feel equally compelled to comment on it for a fourth time. While I don't hold a grudge, and I usually welcome your different opinions, I feel you are way, way off base on this one. As I said in another comment, you are trying to maintain the lofty ideals of norms in the most inappropriate of times. What I sense is that, being Republicans originally, or at least conservatives, you were fond enough of Biden because he had the mojo to beat Trump once. But once he couldn't do that anymore your lack of regard for him is showning through. much the same way I would feel if Reagan were in Biden's place. Now. Can we please not have to read or hear your benighted opinion on this issue anymore? Let's get on with this Administration from Hell and we can all be on the same side again.
There is no such thing as an abuse of the presidential pardon power
The Hunter Biden case is a poster child for the pardon power. It was a miscarriage of justice. If the Biden name wasn’t attached to it, it would be a no-brainer pardon. But, apparently, appearances mean much more than the facts here for many under the Bulwark umbrella. I can only quote Joyce Vance here:
“Just because the trial judges didn’t find selective/vindictive prosecution to the high legal standard required before they can dismiss a case when Hunter Biden’s attorney asked them to do so doesn’t mean the prosecutions weren’t actually tainted by political animus. My office would not have brought these charges, and other former federal prosecutors feel the same way. Former Attorney General Eric Holder tweeted, “Here’s the reality. No US Atty would have charged this case given the underlying facts.” Barb McQuade posted on BlueSky, “Pardon of Hunter Biden is in the best interests of justice. Based on the facts, most federal prosecutors would have declined to charge him.” Former Delaware U.S. Attorney Charlie Oberley, who joined us for “Five Questions” in September 2023 when Hunter Biden’s plea deal fell apart in court said he would not have indicted the case.”
Maybe Tim Miller should have Joyce Vance or Barb McQuade on to discuss the matter.
I hope that most of our Bulwark community will not hold a grudge against some members for stating their beliefs and opinions. Saw some early posts about a few people canceling subscriptions.
I value the fact that We have differing viewpoints and can discuss them intelligently. I have often disagreed with some positions, but have some times also been persuaded to change mine.
Bill was right at the very beginning that Biden should have stepped aside earlier. It took me to that first debate to agree with him. I also did not like the pardon for Hunter, but my dislike is that Joe Biden sprung it upon us with little preparation or explanation. Once again a failure on his part to do the work to sell his decision.
He has always had a little difficulty communicating clearly, but it has gotten much worse as he ages.
He did it, and he had the right to do it. There will be no effect on what Trump does, because he has proven that he will try to do whatever he feels like with no restraint.
Hunter Biden was absolutely the victim of politically biased attacks. Only the poor and disadvantaged are supposed to be targeted with these charges.
Heather CR's letter last night blasts the continuing Dem/Repub double standard in the news media; and points out that it's of even greater concern considering the dark times we're headed into. I don't know where to get a link to it, but she includes a link to another Substack piece that all these people so critical of Joe Biden should read: https://www.meidasplus.com/p/the-big-reason-why-hunters-pardon?utm_source=substack&utm_campaign=post_embed&utm_medium=email.
The reaction from TB crowd has been very disappointing; have they truly considered the alternative: NOT pardoning Hunter? I think almost every writer / podcaster on here, and I'm guessing most posters, are parents; I have a very hard time imagining that a single one of them would not do the same under the circumstances - which are unprecedented in the U.S.
I highly encourage anyone and everyone to read what the Atlantic Monthly has written about Kash Patel starting with "A Constitutional Crisis greater than Watergate..." and working backwards chronologically. His sycophants zeal literally knows no bougds.
Of course the worse thing begat the bad thing. Patel has spent 4 years railing against Hunter to Steve Bannon and others. Eighty two year old Joe is supposed to feed his son to the wolves..? This isn't a pardon in a vacuum, newsflash. Anyone paying attention can see how the ground had shifted with Trump gearing up to take vindictive power. Focusing on Biden going back on his word is what the Bondi/Patel DoJ want you to say, as they genuflect to Trump's bruised ego and grievances rather than administer
justice on behalf of the people. Joe should pardon more people unfairly in their crosshairs. He has a duty to.
I couldn't read past the fourth iteration of bashing Biden for pardoning his sone who was dragged through themed for 5 years over minor charges that would not have seen the light of day if his name wasn't Biden. Freaking trump pardoned REAL criminals and will certainly pardon J/6 criminals, and himself! Can't see the forest for the trees it seems. This is the same false equivalence, both sides garbage that led to trump winning the election again! Why will the next 4 years be hellish? Because legacy media did the both sides crap. Now you guys are doing it. You might as well compare punching someone in the nose to murder and say that it makes no difference because they are both violent acts. I am not disappointed in Biden, but I am disappointed in your analysis and opinions on this subject....
People who say all Bulwark writers are against the Hunter Biden pardon haven't read the Bulwark.
People who say only Republicans are against the Hunter Biden pardon haven't read the bleeping news.
People who cannot formulate an argument without resorting to insults are not worth listening to.
What the h3ll happened to this comment section, I used to actually learn xit from people here all the time. All earthly good is transitory I guess. Ommmmmmmmmmmm
Sorry. I can't imagine any father or mother doing anything differently than Biden did here. He's 82 years old, and if he didn't step in, he might never see his only surviving son outside prison walls ever again. Nope, it's an easy call.
I totally disagree. I support Biden's pardon of his son, Hunter. One little deviation from the norm, and you pounce.
Meanwhile, Trump runs roughshod over every norm.
Hypocrites you are.
I wanted to give you a fair chance. I'm rethinking that.
I agree with you but at the same time I understand Bill's point about how this could undermine our opposition to significant and imminent transgressions from the Trump administration. While I understand and empathize with Biden's decision here I also understand how it can be used to undermine and divide the opposition.
We must not let this happen. We lost this election because we let them divide our coalition over single issues and over 13 million Biden voters sat out this election thereby handing Trump his authoritarian mandate.
No one ever said solidarity was going to be easy, history proves quite the contrary. But when the alternative is an unequivocal devolution into authoritarianism the utilitarian can and must supersede the ideological...